[Ghastly]

You dismissed Wii, xbox, and ps. You're essentially now a PC gamer. Console companies don't need console gamers to dictate what they need to do. You can express it but it's like me asking PC game devs to cater to me.

By the way care to list your top 20 high quality PC games of 2013? Just interested what that looks like. Because that's what it comes down to as far as whether to choose a Wii, a PC, or a PS.

And what business model are you talking about? Console lifecycle is a standard 5 to 6 years. They keep selling for 3 or 4 more years after. Completing a 10 or so year manufacturing cycle. I don't understand what's so hard to understand about that

[Amaro57]

Ghastly, on Jan 15, 2013 - 9:21 AM, said:

MMO friendly? Really? Besides FFXIV and B&S is there an mmorpg matching console game quality? I don't see any mmorpg worth subscribing to. MMORPGs is the last thing console gamers need. This is again a PC gamer's point of view. It's like console gamers wanting PC games to have more storylines, higher quality production, etc.

...I can't even.

More MMOs would probably develop console quality like DQX if it was a viable option. Besides, not all of us can afford gaming rigs as apposed to a cheaper console alternative such as myself which is one of the enticing points of consoles. I was throwing it out as an idea, I don't mean they HAVE to do it, just a nice change of pace for consoles.

Tashigi, on Jan 15, 2013 - 10:11 AM, said:

The business model does affect the production process.
There is nothing wrong in wanting a broader list of features, even if some come from other platforms.
PC has TONS of high production value games; it just so happens you don't care for those type of games. Stop bashing what you don't understand/appreciate blindly. I don't think anyone here has bashed Sony's or any other console's first party/exclusive games, have we?

And again, this isn't about PC or console perspectives.
This is about consumers and developers and the companies in between. You're the only one bringing up the PC/console thing as if were relevant.
So again, if Sony wants my business as a consumer, they better ramp up their game.

I agree. If the next gen are repeats of last gen but just with better hardware, then it's not getting us anywhere if it continues to follow last gen release fiasco. I feel like Nintendo lives in its own world as far as I'm concerned and I hope the Wii U will actually feature some really interesting things.


Hush Tashi. I see that steam of yours full of non-valve games. >:|

[Ghastly]

Sure, but the way you bring out this MMO argument doesn't even make sense..that's a PC born genre. Entirely and completely for PCs. No mmorpgs on consoles has more to do with mmo devs than the consoles. The genre doesn't even have that many games that would work any way. Most of them are free to play and low quality (graphics and customer support).

Quote

I agree. If the next gen are repeats of last gen but just with better hardware, then it's not getting us anywhere if it continues to follow last gen release fiasco.

I see, you're a Nintendo fan who doesn't believe in releasing new consoles and think it won't change much.

[Shinaji]

Ghastly, on Jan 15, 2013 - 9:21 AM, said:

MMO friendly? Really? Besides FFXIV and B&S is there an mmorpg matching console game quality? I don't see any mmorpg worth subscribing to. MMORPGs is the last thing console gamers need. This is again a PC gamer's point of view. It's like console gamers wanting PC games to have more storylines, higher quality production, etc.

What..
Are..
You...
Talking about....

You've can't possibly be serious. You just can't and I refuse to believe that you were serious because it... no just no.
Forget it, I'm out, I'm done.


Anyway back on the actual topic and not what he's talking about.

Like Tashy said they need to make the next gen more consumer/developer focused and less focused on being a closed system, I mean as it stands Xbox is ripping of the developers with how much it costs just to update their titles on the system, which in turn makes things harder for the consumer.
But someone or something needs to do something drastic in order to have them change from their old ways. Nintendo won't be the ones because they live in Nintendo Land. :P See what I did thar :P
That's why I'm hoping the steam box works, drive in some competition. Current consoles haven gotten too comfortable next to each other.

[Ghastly]

Seriously Shinaji? Are all your replies shocked expressions without any kind of substance? I invite you to dispute my claims. But I know you won't.

Consoles will stay consoles, PCs will stay PCs. No change needed since last I looked console yield higher profit than PC gaming

[Tashigi]

You need to update yourself Ghastly, that's all the content w/substance I can put together for you. Specially about the part with PC's staying PC's and console's staying consoles.
Hint: XBOX/PS future hints heavily at streaming formats (Gaikai was bought off by Sony to give you an example) and potentially may allow for more than just hard drive upgrades. On the PC side of things, many third parties are developing their own "consoles" that run or "stream" the Steambox concept; which also happen to be fully customizable and upgradable.

Like I said before... it can go either way at this point.
Don't be so afraid of change; it can only be good in this situation, specially.

Back on topic...
I am actually curious about the looks/design approach of the PS4.
Do we go from Grill Station to Toaster Station or will they come out with something as awesome as the PS2 Slim or the orinigal PSX?

This post has been edited by Tashigi: Jan 15, 2013 - 6:15 PM

[Amaro57]

Ghastly, on Jan 15, 2013 - 4:38 PM, said:

I see, you're a Nintendo fan who doesn't believe in releasing new consoles and think it won't change much.

I said we won't get anywhere if the new consoles don't bring in some new competition/changes. I fail to see how you concluded my sentence meant I'm a "Nintendo fan".

[Shinaji]

Ghastly, on Jan 15, 2013 - 5:21 PM, said:

Seriously Shinaji? Are all your replies shocked expressions without any kind of substance? I invite you to dispute my claims. But I know you won't.

Consoles will stay consoles, PCs will stay PCs. No change needed since last I looked console yield higher profit than PC gaming

It's hard to imagine any sane person saying anything as stupid. I could give you a never ending list of exceptional PC games but then I think about it and well, you aren't worth the effort, I'm sorry.

Discussion closed, no need to respond to me anymore this exchange is over.




Lol Nah Tashy you know we got to have the Big ones first then later release the slim and make some more cash. They won't break the tradition now. Personally most times I'd wait for the slim version to come out, especially since Launch titles aren't always as great. IT's pretty much a tradition now anyway. Lol.

I hope they at the very least keep their PSN store running how it is now, and improve on it. Far better than Xbox's.

Here is another thing to consider, recently F2P games have been creeping onto consoles. Happy Wars, Battle for Middle Earth(?) and Dust514. With those there you'd think they would definitely work out better methods to accommodate such experiences. Still though I guess it will relate to the success of these games and as far as I know Happy Wars is doing fine, Dust514 isn't out yet but it'd be cool, the whole cross platform gaming thing.

Still though hoping they surprise me in May, but until then I'm not too excited just you know lay back sip mah drink and wait and see. Be nice to have more than "Hey! Graphics boost! Even though that's nothing new to you!" Higher FPS would be nice though. Haha.

[Soultaker]

I really hope consoles don't get to the point where we can exchange parts like a PC can because then the games on consoles would become unoptimized due to the developers having to for multiple parts. Which is why I think the consoles can go for so long without having to be re-made for another gen because they can always optimize their code more due to the console always being the same.

I'm looking forward to the PS4 being announced in at E3 though. I'll be putting mine on pre-order when it happends

This post has been edited by Soultaker: Jan 16, 2013 - 12:49 AM

[Tashigi]

That used to be a problem, still can be with some PC's but it's slowly fading into the past, with how more and more engines automatically optimize for developers.
Still, if you build a game from ground (I mean, literally build the entire thing from nothing; including engine) then yes, this can be a problem.
It's good that the more recent and near future engine releases, will be and are more flexible than ever. To the point it almost doesn't pay to make your own engine for your one and only game in specific.

What worries me more, is DX11 and whatever comes in the future of Direct X.
If they release a console soon-ish, then it'll likely be loaded with DX11; but this is a feature that's soon to be updated for PC. And this is usually a hardware-specific feature.
Quite honestly though, after seeing DX11 in full action, I'd rather they stick to it instead of moving to a DX11+ version and just optimize it's performance.
DX11 is brilliant and absolutely gorgeous as it is.

[Soultaker]

something that really bugs me is that apparently Direct X 11.1 will only be available to you if you're on windows 8. I really don't feel like updating to windows 8

[Tashigi]

From what I understood (Correct me if I'm wrong) DX11.1 is just compatibility/performance adjustments for W8 in specific (I think more so for RT?).
Not sure, haven't kept up to date on that.

[Soultaker]

If it was anything similar to how Direct X 10.1 was then I guess. I too am not exactly sure if it's just for performance or an actual update of some kind. Guess i'll go do a bit of digging.

http://msdn.microsof...v=vs.85%29.aspx

Straight from microsofts site

This post has been edited by Soultaker: Jan 16, 2013 - 1:34 AM

[Tashigi]

Seems to be more for compatibility than anything but it does have some improvements.
Overall, seems kinda trivial outside of the W8/RT environment, unless I'm missing something.

[Soultaker]

my worry is when Direct X 12 comes out will it be compatible with W7 or will i be required to update my OS which i really don't feel like doing after the things ive heard about W8

[Ghastly]

Shinaji, on Jan 15, 2013 - 6:48 PM, said:

It's hard to imagine any sane person saying anything as stupid. I could give you a never ending list of exceptional PC games but then I think about it and well, you aren't worth the effort, I'm sorry.

Discussion closed, no need to respond to me anymore this exchange is over.

Keep up the attitude, it's entertaining
0 examples of high quality PC games that aren't already available on consoles with negligible differences.

PS Might want to tone done the name calling. Not fit for a mod

[Amaro57]

Ghastly, on Jan 16, 2013 - 2:17 AM, said:

Keep up the attitude, it's entertaining
0 examples of high quality PC games that aren't already available on consoles with negligible differences.

Dishonored
Borderlands 2
Walking Dead
Mass Effect 3
Farcry 3
Max Payne
Battlefield 3
Rayman Origins
XCOM
Skyrim (Albeit us PS3 users are still crying)
Dues Ex 3
Hitman: Absolution
The Darkness 2
Alan Wake
Sleeping Dogs
Fall of Cybertron

Those are the ones on the edge of my mind right now. Not to mention the indie games which I didn't list as well.

[Ghastly]

Aren't all of those console games? Anyway I'd love to see a list of PC games. You know how for consoles there's stuff like Uncharted 3, Skyward Sword, The Last of Us.

[Amaro57]

Ghastly, on Jan 16, 2013 - 2:36 AM, said:

Aren't all of those console games? Anyway I'd love to see a list of PC games. You know how for consoles there's stuff like Uncharted 3, Skyward Sword, The Last of Us.

That's the point. The divide is disappearing. Saying stuff like " It's like console gamers wanting PC games to have more storylines, higher quality production, etc. " is just ignorance at this point. There's no PCs staying PCs and Consoles staying Consoles.

I'm sure there are a lot of high-quality PC games (perhaps like the Witcher 2 when it was PC only at a point), but most of them have now been ported in one way or another.

And those games you listed are known as "exclusives". It's why people buy an xbox over ps3 or a wii over an xbox and hence forth. There's no reason to bring them in.

This post has been edited by Amaro57: Jan 16, 2013 - 2:43 AM

[Tashigi]

That is a PC list whether it's fit of your "approval" or not.
Most of those, specially Far Cry 3, Max Payne and Hitman, XCOM, Dishonored, are all optimized better on PC.
There is a reason I didn't post a list and its because no matter what it is, you'll invent some new excuse to disjustify it or mock it in some way, despite most games these past few years being third parties.

The only PC exclusive games are those that can't be easily transition to gamepad, such as RTS and MMO.
But that doesn't mean they're PC exclusive. Just the same that Uncharted and other similar games would benefit more graphically on a PC.
You seriously need to stop thinking so emotionally about first party games.