Blade & Soul Dojo: Is class balance a concern for the Korean players? - Blade & Soul Dojo

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Is class balance a concern for the Korean players? Rate Topic: -----

#21
User is offline   Kerberian Kitsune 

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Posted Nov 30, 2012 - 4:49 PM

As long as there isn't any 1-hit KO wonder moves, and skills of their ilk, out there I don't give a crap. I don't care how lengthy the CD were to be if they were to be implemented; but that kind of stuff WILL make me quit. As for one class being perceived as weaker or stronger I care not. I play whatever that is that takes my fancy then of the time; I'm no class turncoat. Feel > slight discrepancies in relative power level. I stuck with a crazy UP in a certain MMO for 4 years, until by that time my patience was rewarded and it was redone. I liked the class concept too much to give up on it, even if my resolve about it threatened to crumble at times. Queerly enough, they remained pretty much joint rarest class played even though they were immensely powerful with that rebalance; well imo... so it's kind of weird how it never became a FotM kinda deal.

I agree with the thing about healers, that's why I'm glad they're gone in this game... their power level relative to what they're expected to output during PvE instances (healing to account for hits that drain's a tank's health by 80% in one strike) vs PvP; never mind just 1vs1 or ManyvsMany. They've consistently put a spanner in the works when it came to balancing them in PvP environments...
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#22
User is offline   Vile Samael 

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Posted Nov 30, 2012 - 10:16 PM

View PostNique no Nihonto, on Nov 30, 2012 - 2:52 PM, said:

The main problem with MMO balance is indeed balancing it between 1v1 and MvM ( many versus many). It's ultra hard to obtain this balance with healers. I'm not going to explain why since it's obvious why. But since B&S don't have healers, it should be simpler. If you are going to give AE damage, give it to all and make sure the overall damage is the same in the same time span. I say that because dps burst is a huge factor in PvP. Range kiting is also worth the attention. If there is range kiting, give melee gap closer skills which I believe blade masters already have.

edit: Just wanted to add to the range kiting point. Don't give the melee an OP range damage skill like the idiotic Slayers have in TERA. How stupid is that? Pretty much ultra stupid. But I will give Blue Hole a 3 out of 5 stars since they are beginners. NC Soft does not have the luxury of owning such an excuse.

KFMs and assassins have gap closers too, so I think all melee classes have them. There's also a min range for KFMs so you'd have to know their range to kite them, which is where skill comes into play. Not so sure about BM and Sin ranges, though.
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#23
User is offline   Zenek 

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Posted Dec 01, 2012 - 5:56 AM

Something what you said means KFM can do nothing with kitter who just keep correct distance. In situation like that I do not see skill, just abuse system. From something what you said means a broken system. The worst of all it is about 1v1, so this is even worst in mass PvP.

But gap closers is one thing, positioning is second one. Gap closers, in mass PvP do not fix fact melee are much more exposed to be attacked than range who just spam from range.
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#24
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Posted Dec 01, 2012 - 6:09 AM

KFM has 3 gap closer skills.
2 are learned in early levels, adds battle energy, the 3rd is a 4 hit skill.

the 1st, i call pounce, you must be more than a certain distance away to use. from what i remember the other 2 can be used from point blank and far away.
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#25
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Posted Dec 01, 2012 - 1:24 PM

View PostDayBreeze, on Dec 01, 2012 - 6:09 AM, said:

KFM has 3 gap closer skills.
2 are learned in early levels, adds battle energy, the 3rd is a 4 hit skill.

the 1st, i call pounce, you must be more than a certain distance away to use. from what i remember the other 2 can be used from point blank and far away.

Alright there we go, thank you.
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#26
User is offline   Nique no Nihonto 

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Posted Dec 02, 2012 - 1:05 AM

View PostZenek, on Dec 01, 2012 - 5:56 AM, said:

Something what you said means KFM can do nothing with kitter who just keep correct distance. In situation like that I do not see skill, just abuse system. From something what you said means a broken system. The worst of all it is about 1v1, so this is even worst in mass PvP.

But gap closers is one thing, positioning is second one. Gap closers, in mass PvP do not fix fact melee are much more exposed to be attacked than range who just spam from range.


they can spam from range because the opponent allows it, especially from melees that have gap closers. this game, like TERA has 2 (maybe 3) skills that melee's can use to immobilize your opponent once the gap is closed all the while beating the crap out of them... stuns and knockdowns. if you've ever pvp'd, those 2 skills alone will destroy a kiter. don't call the lack of environmental awareness a game mechanic that needs fixing. that's preposterous. the ones ignoring range is the one that needs fixing. they can fix that problem by stop queueing in BG's until they learn that skill to look around them for enemy dps'ers that is not getting the attention they deserve. jeez.

This post has been edited by Nique no Nihonto: Dec 02, 2012 - 1:08 AM

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#27
User is offline   Zenek 

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Posted Dec 02, 2012 - 5:00 AM

Allows? Tell me, are you joke? Issues with range DPS is they can DPS all the time. What melee can do in mass PVP? If uses gap closer to get range DPS, then will get jumped by few others. Range DPS always stay middle of own team - that is what I talk about melee are much more exposed to attacks.

Games like Tera you said... Tera is example of bad blanced game. Once I won even 1 vs 4 melee on my sorc. Gap closers in this game are completly negated by number of skills what allow range classes to escape. Skills what you said - backstab is the only way in Tera to catch range class, but classes who have this skills have simply too low DPS to kill even cloth class before it run away. The most easy to see it, is BG data announced by EME where K/D ratio between melee and range DPS is massive unbalanced.
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#28
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Posted Dec 02, 2012 - 8:52 AM

View PostZenek, on Dec 02, 2012 - 5:00 AM, said:

Allows? Tell me, are you joke? Issues with range DPS is they can DPS all the time. What melee can do in mass PVP? If uses gap closer to get range DPS, then will get jumped by few others. Range DPS always stay middle of own team - that is what I talk about melee are much more exposed to attacks.

Games like Tera you said... Tera is example of bad blanced game. Once I won even 1 vs 4 melee on my sorc. Gap closers in this game are completly negated by number of skills what allow range classes to escape. Skills what you said - backstab is the only way in Tera to catch range class, but classes who have this skills have simply too low DPS to kill even cloth class before it run away. The most easy to see it, is BG data announced by EME where K/D ratio between melee and range DPS is massive unbalanced.


Its funny you say this, as I recall everyone whining that the Slayer (the one with Backstab) was OPed and beat everyone in one on one.

You took on four melee's and won? Then the melee's where either under your level, not good at all, or you're lying.

Not to mention, if it's all about ranged DPS, then go make your guild of all ranged users, and then come back and tell us how well the guild does in PvP.
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#29
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Posted Dec 02, 2012 - 12:22 PM

The OP is right, Blizzard has made more changes (nerfs & buffs) to classes they any mmo I have ever played, WoW is designed only for group pvp (2v2, 3v3, 5v5). There have been consistent 1v1 classes like mages & rogues throughout the seasons but now with MoP patch 5.0 - 5.1 1v1 is more unbalanced then it ever has been. My shadowpriest could kill every class 1v1 every season but this one, I haft to play my rogue to duel most classes now. As again, mage & rogue have always been the most consistent 1v1 classes since the beginning of WoW.

So with B&S's 1v1 tournament system that yells out to me that the game will be centered around 1v1 and of course group pvp, there is not a trinity system in B&S it doesn't look like so that is cool. Skill will play more of a part in B&S then your class & gear is what I gather.

This post has been edited by SaibotMK: Dec 02, 2012 - 12:24 PM

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#30
User is offline   Zenek 

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Posted Dec 02, 2012 - 12:45 PM

View PostBrandX, on Dec 02, 2012 - 8:52 AM, said:

Its funny you say this, as I recall everyone whining that the Slayer (the one with Backstab) was OPed and beat everyone in one on one.

You took on four melee's and won? Then the melee's where either under your level, not good at all, or you're lying.

Not to mention, if it's all about ranged DPS, then go make your guild of all ranged users, and then come back and tell us how well the guild does in PvP.


I always just laughed from ppl what called slayer OP. This class had twice weak points as any other class. Almost all of slayers skills was easy to dodge because of 1+ sec animations on it. Do slayer use KD-strike? All what need is move at his side -here skill do not have hitboxes. Move from him if use whirlind etc.

They was same lvl. But fact, it was before backstab.

My clan over 5 years used this setup in Lineage 2 - only nukers or archers + support. Effect of this was always lethal. There are only profits from it. Easy to focus target, easier to stay together in tight formation, easier to avoid get focused.
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#31
User is offline   Nique no Nihonto 

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Posted Dec 02, 2012 - 1:25 PM

View PostBrandX, on Dec 02, 2012 - 8:52 AM, said:

Its funny you say this, as I recall everyone whining that the Slayer (the one with Backstab) was OPed and beat everyone in one on one.

You took on four melee's and won? Then the melee's where either under your level, not good at all, or you're lying.

Not to mention, if it's all about ranged DPS, then go make your guild of all ranged users, and then come back and tell us how well the guild does in PvP.


yeah, he is lying. either that or he was a post-buffed priest taking on 4 equal level players in open world. also, i see a lot of (and i mean a truck load) of people all the time in BG's compliment themselves in chat how they just killed solo 2 or more enemies, but leave the fact out that they were all near death because the allies helping him (and he let die) are dead and all he had to do was 1 shot them to kill them. lol!

he likes to throw out backstab out there. lol. that was a warrior skill too. the gap closer that slayers used was dash which i think was on a 10 second cd. and let me tell you that 1 cd of dash is enough to catch up to a sorcerer who teleport jaunt 2 times and jaunt had a 14 second cd!! lol. this guy is dumb as a rock and a fan boy and lies to cover up the mistake of his logic.

i'm going to stop paying attention to him from here unti he straightens out his facts.

and range can't dps all the time. another mistake. they have cast timers for their powerful spells and attacks to prevent kiting with it. in TERA, they are called animations. when a melee ALLOWS a range class to charge up their most damaging spells, THAT IS THEIR FAULT!!!!! and i like how you added the gang banging on melee in MvM like it's only him in the BG versus many others. lol. so, these guys aren't pre-occupied with the melee's teammates? why is your team hitting on the melee?? why don't they get the range dps'ers behind them and kill him? he's pretty powerful you know. were you the one who taught your team how to pvp? seriously, just ignore him.

And regarding Slayer skills, have you heard of glyphs? they can knockdown multiple times in a few seconds unlike the warrior. plus they have that high kick that stuns!!! and when you are in combat, your movement is reduced by practically half so it is not easy to get out of the way!! and to top it off, they have that ridiculous range skill that is enough to put you at half health with a low cooldown that can also knock you down while you are trying to run away from the OP slayer!! and just to put more icing on this range skill that Slayers use, it goes AGAINST the targetting mechanics of the game!!!!! Just make sure your target is in front of you and it will hit them. your target reticule doesn't have to be on them. it's a huge wide cone in front of you!! why is it a huge wide cone? it's a single target hitting skill! it defies logic of the game mechanics! seriously, just ignore him.

http://tera-forums.e...read-insightful

This post has been edited by Nique no Nihonto: Dec 02, 2012 - 1:58 PM

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#32
User is offline   Zenek 

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Posted Dec 02, 2012 - 2:45 PM

View PostNique no Nihonto, on Dec 02, 2012 - 1:25 PM, said:

and let me tell you that 1 cd of dash is enough to catch up to a sorcerer who teleport jaunt 2 times and jaunt had a 14 second cd!! lol. this guy is dumb as a rock and a fan boy and lies to cover up the mistake of his logic.


Heh... that is funny how lame some sorcs are... spamming teleport in fight versus melee. To win with slayer, or any other melee do not need spam 2x teleport to move away 40m from them, get fu** camera and have target out of own range. TJ is good only to escape from slayer backstab, only for it. Sorc have Backstep and Glacial Retreat (70% slow for target as bonus), both have 5 sec CD.

Btw. TJ have 12 sec. CD, not 14.
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